Today opposites attract as we mess up lyrics and trade recipes with Kaitlin and Sarah Leung of The Woks of Life. We discuss nests vs cakes as well as frying approaches as we avoid too much sauce and discover the importance of arm length. Warning: contains excessive snacking
The Woks of Life
Shredded Pork Pan-fried Noodles
Simple Spicy Pan-fried Noodles
Listen to our spinoff show Dire Desires
Join our reddit
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:00
Hi. I'm Matthew.
Molly 0:05
And I'm Molly.
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:06
And this is spilled milk, the show where we cook something delicious. Eat it all and you can't have any.
Molly 0:11
Today we have a special guest who I bet every single one of our listeners is already a fan of. I'm so excited. But okay, wait, let me say first what the show is.
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:23
It's Paula Abdul Paula.
Molly 0:26
Well, it's because of well, for years now, we've always said that opposites attract. Like the two of us why
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:33
you and I came together?
Molly 0:34
That's right. I take things easy.
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:37
And I like to smoke.
Molly 0:38
No, baby. I make a mess or No,
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:41
wait. Wait a really important question.
Molly 0:44
I did it wrong. Go ahead. Which which 1am? I am I the the cartoon cat or Paul?
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:51
Literally exactly what I was going to ask. I think you're I think your MC Skat. Kat.
Molly 0:55
So Matthew, hold on. I have we even said yet what the show is about today. Oh, I
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:00
don't know. I ever remember things that happened like four minutes ago.
Molly 1:03
Okay. Okay, so today's episode is pan fried noodles.
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:08
Yeah. And our special guest is the I'm gonna say better than Paula Abdul. Take it out.
Molly 1:14
Yes, definitely better than the weird cartoon cat like by a million times. Oh, and here comes our special guest
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:25
so to teach us about pan fried noodles. Today we've got Kaitlin and Sarah Leung from the walks of life. And the walks of life is just one of the best recipe and cooking blogs of all time. It was created by a family of four Bill Judy Sarah and Caitlin Leung. And it is spilled milk is number one resource for Chinese cuisine. And if you've listened to this show, like it's probably yours also. Many recipes from the walk walks of life are certainly Amster-Burton family favorites. And it is now also a best selling cookbook, the walks of life recipes to know and love from a Chinese American family. And we are delighted to have Sarah and Caitlin on spilled milk today, Sarah and Caitlin, welcome to the show.
Sarah Leung 2:02
Thank you.
Kaitlin Leung 2:03
Hi, thanks for having us.
Molly 2:05
Congratulations on your book launch. I feel so lucky that we are able to talk with the two of you in the midst of such a busy time. So Congrats.
Kaitlin Leung 2:13
Thanks. Yeah, it's been a whirlwind for sure. Oh, yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:16
I bet. Yeah. How's how's it going? Like, Have you have you done any any, like memorable events or met any cool people so far? I mean, aside from us for obviously.
Kaitlin Leung 2:24
Yeah. I mean, we have met some really cool people. We got to me, J Kenji Lopez alt, which is super exciting. Obviously, we know of him. Many people do. But yeah, we got to meet him in person and chat with him at book larder out in Seattle. So that was really great. Awesome. Yeah. And then we've also met Grace Young, who is like, I love Grace. Yeah, she is like an icon and an OG and such a great advocate for Chinatown's and for Chinese cooking. So, you know, we like brought our copies of her books for her to side. And you know, we just had a great panel discussion with her the other day, actually about authenticity and Chinese cooking. So yeah, it's just been really awesome. Because we're usually like, hidden behind our computers like at our house in the middle of shore, New Jersey, and it's been really great getting out and meeting people and meeting readers too.
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:23
Yeah, we've we've had Kenji on the show. We should we should ask Grace if she would be on our show. Yeah,
Kaitlin Leung 3:28
she's amazing.
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:29
So what are pan fried noodles? Like, let's let's jump right in.
Sarah Leung 3:34
Yeah. So I think that there's a lot of confusion when it comes to pan fried noodles, because you see a lot of different translations of it. And they're, they're just so many like, quote, unquote, fried noodle dishes out there that sometimes be confusing, but a pan fried noodle is primarily a Hong Kong style crispy noodle that you you boil the noodle first to cook it and then you can fry it in oil. And you get this like really crispy kind of thin, golden noodle that you can then either stir fry with other ingredients. Or you could just have this kind of fried golden cake of noodles and then put on top of it like a stir fry of like meat and vegetables.
Matthew Amster-Burton 4:22
Yeah, we call it crispy noodle cake in my house. Like when someone requests it for dinner. That's what they say. Yes,
Sarah Leung 4:27
that's accurate.
Molly 4:28
So will you talk a little bit about the type of noodle that you use?
Sarah Leung 4:32
Yeah, so it's a thin Hong Kong style noodle, you'll find it in Chinese grocery stores. Not to be confused with Hong Kong style wonton noodles which can sometimes trip people up because they look kind of similar. They're a similar thickness and they're both kind of they have like that yellowish color. One the wonton noodle is actually meant to be cooked in soup while the pan fried noodle is meant to be obviously pan fried, so you'll find it in the Chinese group. resort labeled, literally Hong Kong style pan fried noodle, you can actually buy it fresh, or you could buy it dried. So you can see it in the refrigerated section near the other fresh noodles. Or you can go to the dry noodle aisle. And some of the varieties have like our like shrimp flavored, if that's your thing, they actually have shrimp added to the noodle dough, which is also really delicious. And something that we ate a lot of when we were in Hong Kong a few years ago.
Molly 5:28
Is this the kind of dish where like, if you can't find that particular noodle, can you substitute or should you just make something else?
Sarah Leung 5:36
It's really tough. I would say make something else, honestly. Because I've actually tried, I've tried with other noodles, and I've actually tried making them from scratch. So we have a Chinese egg noodle recipe on the blog. And I was like, hey, these kinds of things look a little bit like the pan fried noodles. And I was like, I wonder if I could pan fry them. And it's just not the same. No, it doesn't really work. The noodle itself is is almost like it has a kind of a dry ish texture. Yeah, that's
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:08
what I was gonna say. Yeah. And
Sarah Leung 6:09
so if you try to pan fry a regular fresh noodle dough, it just kind of turns out, it's not as crispy. It kind of like cakes together and doesn't like stay separate. So it's a challenging one for sure.
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:22
Yeah, the brand that I've seen most often is I think twin marquee I always get the twin marquee Twin Dragon brands confused.
Sarah Leung 6:28
Those are classic brands. Yeah, yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:31
I have I have occasionally substituted like something that I found like in the you know, Asian ingredients aisle at the at the supermarket. And like, I don't mind if it kind of like motions together into a cake as long as it's crispy on the outside. So if that sounds like it could be your thing, it won't be the same, but it's worth a shot
Sarah Leung 6:50
in the shot. Yeah, and if you're if like if, for example, you're gluten free, sure, try, you could attempt it with like a rice noodle where you like, you know, you boil the rice noodles, you rinse them off to get rid of the excess starch, you kind of let them dry off a bit and just fluff them up a bit and like maybe toss them in a little bit of oil and then try to pan fry it like I haven't actually personally tried it but I feel like it's worth a shot. Especially if you're gluten free.
Matthew Amster-Burton 7:17
So in the book you've got like a beef and vegetable stir fried dish to serve on top of pan fried noodles, which which looks excellent. And then I noticed on the on the website, you've got many stir fried noodles, or fried noodle dishes can you serve at stir fry on top of pan fried noodles? And if not, like how do you choose one that will go well,
Sarah Leung 7:36
I think you can. Like you can essentially serve any stir fry you like over a pan fried noodle. I think that ideally, the stir fry is relatively saucy, because you want that sauce to kind of seep into the noodles and flavor them and but not too much sauce because sometimes there's too much sauce and then you lose the crispness of the noodle. Yeah, but the classics are kind of there's a chicken version, which we have on the blog. We did the beef version for the cookbook. Actually, one of my favorites is the pork pan fried noodle because it has Chinese garlic chives in it and it's a really tasty delicate flavor. They're actually dishes where there's no sauce at all or like the the noodle dish is primarily dry. And this is like a dry stir fry and the texture of the noodle is just is mostly just crispy. Which that one's one of my favorites. Excellent.
Kaitlin Leung 8:33
I feel like you also left out the seafood variety.
Sarah Leung 8:37
Oh yes, seafood is another one. Oh for sure. With shrimp and scallops
Kaitlin Leung 8:41
and squid squid. Yeah, squid. Why not?
Molly 8:45
So for listeners who may have never made or eaten these kinds of pan fried noodles? Is the goal to have sort of this like cake with defined boundaries? Or do you want it to be like almost like a nest of noodles that you can unravel? Or is it up to the chef or the cook?
Kaitlin Leung 9:04
I'm glad you asked this question. It's a good question. Because I think most for most of our lives we've been used to more of like a nest of noodles where it's crispy. There are some like more soft parts so you get like more of a variety of texture and I think actually something that has become a popular shortcut especially in restaurants is like just kind of like shallow frying the noodles into like a cake form and that's where that kind of like cake shape I think like that term probably comes from and then you get like it's almost like crispy to the extreme and I'll speak for myself but I also think that this is the case in our entire family like we prefer the nest approach where it's a little bit less like high octane of the crispy factor and then you get like more of like the you can actually like pick up some you get a good noodle pull out of it.
Matthew Amster-Burton 9:58
Okay, this is really interesting because I have always done like the high octane crispy cake version at home and so now I am going to like take it take it upon myself and take your advice and and try the the Morton desk like approach,
Kaitlin Leung 10:11
but there's different philosophy. Yeah, for sure. You know, Sarah will stand over the stove and like really make sure that like almost every noodle is Chris, whereas when I'm making it, I like to back off earlier because I like little chewy feeling and I don't like to just feel like I'm kind of like eating this pile of like, Matchstick noodles, but Sarah will like scoff at me and be like, you simpleton. Like you're eating your crispy noodles. Not that crispy. And I'm like, to each their own?
Molly 10:43
I haven't. So I have a question about this then. So okay, when you're flipping the cake of pan fried noodles, can you just like flip it in that like confident Sheffy way? Or do you have to use like a couple spatulas and a plate and or does it depend upon like the style in which you're cooking them.
Matthew Amster-Burton 11:01
And if you can't do this, feel free to lie and say you can whose
Kaitlin Leung 11:06
I feel like it's really a forgiving dish. It's not even as nerve racking I don't think as like a frittata can be if I were to make it I would just flip it in sections. Like I would take a spatula and like, you know, flip it in quarters. If you have the arm strength and like the arm length, like my my short arm just like can't handle like every shape of walk like doing a one generous lip like I'm like, you know, like I kind of struggle a little bit. You could do it in one go if you feel competent. But yeah, even if it kind of flops over you just straighten it out a little bit. And you know, they're noodles so you can kind of reshape them. Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 11:47
the thing I do at home and like like we said like I like make make like the the matchstick overly overly crisp noodle approach. I will like slide it out of the pan onto a plate. Then I'll put another plate on top of that and flip it and then slide it back in. So I've like dirty two plates on necessarily dishwashers.
Sarah Leung 12:06
Exactly. Yes.
Matthew Amster-Burton 12:07
So I noticed while while we were researching for this episode that a pan fried noodle dish was one of the was maybe the first episode you ever published on walks of life? I'm not sure if it was one of the ones that you that you mentioned we were when we were talking about different topics. I think it was like the spicy one.
Sarah Leung 12:23
Yes, it was the very first recipe that we recorded on the blog, way back into 2013. And it was it was that because actually, you know, we talk about the origin story of the blog a lot, you know, my sister and I grew up loving to cook. But we realized we had no idea how to cook like the foods that our parents prepared for us growing up, maybe we took them for granted a little bit. And so we started the blog to record those recipes. But I would say that like the one Chinese thing that we reliably could make was these pan fried noodles, because they're so easy. And our mom taught us how to make them at a really early age. Often it was like our after school snack, I'm saying it snack in air quotes because it was like a full meal. But it's basically just as I mentioned, you boil the noodles for not long, like one minute, you drain them, and then you pan fry them and oil on both sides. You go for whatever Christian level you prefer. And from there, you take them out, you put them on a plate, you drizzle with a little bit of Chinese light soy sauce, a little bit of sesame oil, and maybe a little bit of chili oil. If that's your thing, if you want a little bit of white pepper on there, that adds a little something. You mix it and that's it. It's the easiest recipe ever. And it was the first one we recorded because it was the one that we actually knew how to make. Like I literally had it for lunch two days ago. Like we still eat it really often. I love it. Yeah, it's one of my my all time favorite, like easy meals to throw together.
Kaitlin Leung 13:57
It's one of those recipes where it's almost terrifying. Like when you sit down, you're like, I think that's enough. And then you're like, well maybe like a little more than just one more handful. And then like you have this play that's just like bounded with noodles. And like as you eat it, you're just like, and like it's like it just gone. Like where like if you were to sit down and eat the equivalent amount of spaghetti like you might be like concerned, but like the noodles are so like thin and light and just like delicious. Like that's why we call it a quote unquote snack. It's not actually that feeling to be fair to us about that feeling. But yeah, it's just like incredibly delicious. And like when you use like your preferred chili oil because like now there's many out there. You know, it's that much better.
Matthew Amster-Burton 14:47
We will we will link to that recipe in the show notes. It's built out podcast.com Molly's heard this story a million times but when I was so soon now as an adult like I have an embarrassingly small appetite for a food person but when I was a teenager I frequent after school snack could for me would be I would come home from school, I would get a couple of Costco burger patties out of the freezer, I would turn on the gospel reel a couple random I put a couple of Kraft Singles on there, and that would be my after school snack, and then I would eat dinner. who that guy was.
Molly 15:22
So I remember a time Oh, it was when Matthew and I recorded an episode about like apple varieties or something. And Matthew probably the equivalent of half an average sized apple and was like, Oh, God, Oh, that's really filling.
Kaitlin Leung 15:39
Hey, fiber.
Matthew Amster-Burton 15:40
Yeah, sure. Fiber. I hate to hit a wall at some point. So speaking, speaking of things that that can be very crispy, if that's where you like it. So this is not a noodle dish, but I just wanted to highlight the Hong Kong style crispy rice skillet recipe in the book is one of my favorite things I have ever made in my kitchen. Oh, like, especially like, No, I have I've had clay pot rice in Hong Kong. You know, it loved it. It was like the whole experience was wonderful. I was like, but I could never recreate that at home. I can get it at a restaurant in Seattle. And then like I made your your cast iron skillet version at home. And it was like every bit as good and perfectly crisp and released perfectly. Everyone should buy the book and try that recipe too.
Sarah Leung 16:25
Thank you.
That's fine. That was
Kaitlin Leung 16:29
really late. Well, first, my dad labored over that one and then kind of passed it up pass the baton to Sarah. Yeah, to bring it on home.
Sarah Leung 16:38
We did a lot of recipes switching throughout the writing process when we were like, oh, man, I'm really stuck on this one you want to trade and we would like trade recipes. Oh, that's so interesting. struggling with? Yeah. So my dad was really struggling with that one. And I was like, Dude, you gotta soak the rice. And he was like, no, he's like, not gonna do anything. And I was like, let me try it. And I have to say, got that one on the first try. It was a good one.
Matthew Amster-Burton 17:04
Do you remember any any other notable recipe trades? This didn't even occur to me
Kaitlin Leung 17:08
when I was thinking of Sara's the mango pudding. But I can't remember what I gave to you back.
Sarah Leung 17:13
I don't remember. But we ended up cutting. Yeah, it's on. But we did cut it out of the book. I think that there were some there were definitely some seafood recipes that we all just kind of pushed on to my dad because he is like the king of preparing seafood. And I was just like, I don't know how to do this like. Yeah, so it was funny, you know, when we were assigning the recipes to each of the four of us. So each of us did around a quarter of the recipes in the book. We definitely like played to each other's strengths. So like my dad kind of lead on a lot of the, the meat and the fish dishes. And then you know, my mom did a lot of the very traditional recipes. And then my sister and I were you know where you see like, lazy girl noodles, or like that kind of stuff is us. So yeah, it was really fun to write the book together.
Kaitlin Leung 18:13
And one that got kicked back and forth a lot at least between me and my mom was the motto recipe. There's a recipe for like, it's like a steamed white bread. It's sort of like a neutral, very neutral sort of fluffy white bun. That's like popular in northern China is like a substitute for rice actually. So it can be eaten steamed like with savories. Or it can be eaten as a dessert dipped in condensed milk. As with most breads, like Montel is just like deceptively simple, but ultimately, it's credibly, like beguiling to make at home. That's really because there's all sorts of like litmus tests of like, when you've like reached monto nirvana of like, Oh, if you like press it down, does it like slowly bounce back and like, the outside should be like, very free of a minimal of bubbles. And like the skin quote, unquote, the skin should be like thin and like smooth. And like I just just like driven to the brink of sanity with that recipe. Sure. So like my mom, my mom had to like step in. She's like, do you want me to help you? And I was like, Yes, please.
Matthew Amster-Burton 19:20
It sounds so so nice. Like such a nice way to work like Molly and I have both written not not cookbooks, but but food books with recipes. And we did it like solo and the idea of like having like several family members to foist the tough recipes off on sounds really appealing.
Molly 19:36
And it's very nice. So for people who are not already all up on the walks of life, where can people find you online?
Sarah Leung 19:44
Everybody can find us at the walks of life.com or walks of life.com You got it? Yeah, we'll get you to the same place.
Kaitlin Leung 19:53
It's a recent development that isn't recent development.
Matthew Amster-Burton 19:56
And you have to like pay some domain squatter we
Sarah Leung 20:00
Did so this this domain guy, like it was something like 10 years ago offered it to us for a lot of money and I was like, that's okay. But we'll pass. And then I think he just got tired of waiting and was like, Listen, I'll give it to you for this. And I was like, okay, that's so that was good. But yes, the walks of life.com we also have a YouTube channel, the walks of life. We're also on Instagram. We're on Facebook, and we are on Pinterest as well.
Matthew Amster-Burton 20:29
All right, and the book is the walks of life recipes to know and love from a Chinese American family. I don't know why I'm holding it up because this is not a video podcast.
Kaitlin Leung 20:38
Hey, we like to see it. Yeah, you can get it wherever
Matthew Amster-Burton 20:40
you get books, you know where to get books. So Caitlin and Sarah, thank you again for being on spilled milk. This was a delight.
Kaitlin Leung 20:46
Thank you so much. Thank
Sarah Leung 20:47
you both. This
Kaitlin Leung 20:48
is great.
Matthew Amster-Burton 20:56
Do we need to say anything else about pan fried news? I feel like I feel like Sarah and Caitlin really covered it. Do I have memory lane? My memory lane is like you know I used to I used to make this when December was little and sometimes they would say that their pick of the week was crispy noodle cake. That's it.
Molly 21:13
I keep meaning to institute this pic of the week thing at my household. But the thing is, is I don't I don't plan dinners as a lump like you do when Hold on. Wait, when do you plan the menu for the week
Matthew Amster-Burton 21:24
I've really gotten out of out of the habit. And like now that we're empty nesters like pics of the week don't happen as frequently like usually just went December comes home for holidays. And it's a lot it's a lot looser and more and more improvised these days. Because like I'm a chill. I'm a chill older guy who just like you know, life. I surrounded a robe and like weirdly creepy. I guess
Molly 21:49
I was waiting for you to finish the sentence like I'm increased. I'm just a chill older guy who lies around in a row. I was just gonna go
Matthew Amster-Burton 21:58
most. Mostly what I say on the show is a lies. Yeah.
Molly 22:02
Well, that's why we're really grateful that Sarah and Caitlin came in today to set the record straight.
Matthew Amster-Burton 22:07
Yes. All right. So shall we shall we do some segments?
Molly 22:10
Yeah, Matthew, I've
Matthew Amster-Burton 22:11
been snacking. Okay, my question to you based on that statement is Hey, watch your snacking. Gotta tell me what you snack in. Or I'll release the Kraken so what's your snack in
Molly 22:26
cheese? Okay, at the time that we are recording this episode because you know we always record a little bit before you the listener hears it not live for instance. That's right, right. So Matthew recently got back from Tokyo came over to my house to visit our baby and brought me a literal sack full of treats from Tokyo and one of one of the treats was something you have mentioned in a recent episode Matthew would you pronounce it properly what these rice crackers are I think
Matthew Amster-Burton 22:57
actually I'm like giving a different a brand name of a different one but the one the one that I bought in the past which I think is a slightly different brand is was a was a Kouachi wat a SAM Bay Okay, so it's like deliberately smashed Sam Bay.
Molly 23:08
The only part I could remember was was a was up because I really
Matthew Amster-Burton 23:11
like just called the was a was is okay. What was it was it means deliberately?
Molly 23:15
I mean, for me with my like with the particular vernacular of my head. I hear it a little bit like Fonzie the bear like waka, waka. Oh, yeah. Yeah, sure. Yeah. So anyway, was a Waza. These Broken deliberately broken rice crackers, and they are like, coated in this like spicy, slightly tingly stuff. And anyway, Matthew, they're so good. And yesterday, June saw me eating some pretty spicy. Well, June was like, Can I try one? And I was like, yeah, totally. And she was like, How spicy are they? And I decided not to sugarcoat it. I said, they're pretty spicy. June chowed. Down.
Matthew Amster-Burton 23:57
They are the same spice level as Flaming Hot Cheetos. So of course, kids are gonna like him.
Molly 24:02
Question for you, Matthew. Yeah. If I wanted to be able to get some in the States. Can I find them at my local Asian market? You know, that carries a bunch of Japanese things. What do you think that is a good question.
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:16
I've gotten the non spicy version of these at a uwajimaya many times I have not looked to see if they're carrying the spicy ones. But I'm hoping they are. I will report back to you on this soon. Okay. Or
Molly 24:29
maybe we could even link to Yeah, to some of them that could be you know, ordered online on
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:35
the show. So yeah, they seem they seem like they've gotten super popular in Japan. You know, they have them at at the convenience stores at the Combini. Like they'll have like individual size packs of the regular and the spicy. What I
Molly 24:47
love about the particular crunch of it. Is that like it's a really dense crunch. Rice crackers are a very different kind of crunch from say a flaming hot Cheeto. Oh yeah, but these are even correct. and cheer because Oh, yeah.
Matthew Amster-Burton 25:00
Did I tell you my crunchy rice cracker story from a recent trip to Tokyo? I don't think so. Okay, there's this little teeny tiny tea cafe in Tokyo that I love called Sumo. Yeah, it's a. They're they're originally from Kagoshima. And they have this little tiny outpost in Tokyo. That really is a walk up counter that also has two seats. So I took why for the show, Laurie to this who is not a huge Japanese green tea fan. She likes the whole G chopped roasted tea better than the Sencha green tea. But like for some reason, like I walked up to the counter and said, like, give me two Sanchez. And the sense that this place is super bitter and intense the way I like it, and not necessarily the way Watsa likes it. So she's like sipping this very bitter tea, just like, Can we get a snack to go with this? Like, how about one of those STEM Bay's like, so they had a, like a big Sam bay with rock sugar coating on it. And so I'm like, Yeah, let's let's have one of those. So we cracked open this Sam Bay, and it was the loudest Sam bay in the world. So we're sitting sitting in this this tranquil, tiny little tea shop, like crunching like barbarians. It was very satisfying. Fantastic. No, it was delicious.
Molly 26:15
Ah, okay. All right. I look forward to seeing maybe some some sources that we can find. Okay,
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:22
I will definitely I'm on it.
Molly 26:24
Okay, Matthew, what's your snack in? Oh, I didn't actually prep anything for this episode. Oh, that's cool, because I feel like my watch a snack and it's sort of a collaborative which it
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:33
is a collaborative snack. Yeah, yeah, we are. We're starting a new a new startup called snack collab to wait for people like remote workers to collaborate on snacks. And we're looking for some venture capital.
Molly 26:47
Oh, yes. Yeah, we're always looking for pretend we're recording
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:51
this before that bank collapse did like venture capital explode.
Molly 26:56
But Matthew, on the bright side, do we have any mail?
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:59
We do? We do have some sealed bail
it's from listener Marina. I recently read this article from gastro obscura and was wondering if host Matthew has eaten at Tachibana and she links to an article from the gastro obscura website by a friend of the show and recent now but wow pic Florentino Liao who wrote an article about this traditional citrus fruit in Japan called the top to bottom so listen to Marina continues. Years ago I read an article in lucky peach magazine rip about these apricots that you can only get in Turkey and it makes me really want to travel just to eat these things. Are there any rare foods that you host and our producer of spilled milk podcast have eaten while traveling or would like to travel and eat? So my first off I have not eaten a Tachibana I've eaten several other like Japanese native citrus fruits but not that one. Molly Have you have you eaten any like rare or unusual foods special foods while traveling or are there any you would like to you know,
Molly 27:59
I mean something that comes to mind Matthew is so especially on the the first trip that I ever took to Tokyo with you where it was just the two of us do want to break into song.
Matthew Amster-Burton 28:10
Just the two of us. There we go. You can snack it if we try.
Molly 28:15
So we went to Taco which is the store that has all of these like expensive, fancy fruits. You know, this isn't exactly rare, but there's nowhere else that I can think of that I could get it. We went to the like parfait counter in the puff area. And I had a melon parfait and so it was like this. Like the most perfectly ripe it was a green melon but it had like the most incredible aroma. It wasn't your ordinary honeydew it was just mind blowingly good this this melon. And you know I think that fruit is a really interesting I'm so glad that Marina brought up fruit because I think that fruit is a really interesting case like I'm thinking of this melon in it at Taco. I'm also thinking of traveling in France and encountering plums that I've never had before like these green plums called CLIN clothed or like Queen clawed plums, which I think now you can find in other places or even Mirabelle plums, which used to be harder to find these like small yellowish and greenish plums. It just blew my mind that something as simple as a plum could be so different across an ocean.
Matthew Amster-Burton 29:35
Oh yeah, fruit. Yeah, because fruit like there are still like a lot of fruits that that don't travel well and so like it's something still be truly local.
Molly 29:43
So when Wait, I have another thought. Yeah. So you know, like Damson plums in the UK these tiny like almost grape sized plums, right? And they have a pit inside which leaves not a lot of room for flesh. And they are really, really prized for for making jam? Well, like I don't know anybody who's growing dams and plums in large quantities in the states except mer taki Fall course in Washington State. So anyway, yeah, these fruits really I don't know why I keep thinking of plums, but these fruits that that are really prized in other places, I find it so exciting to encounter them maybe even more than other more elaborate dishes like it's just especially maybe because they're only available for short seasons, so it feels extra special when you happen to be there at the right time.
Matthew Amster-Burton 30:35
What this made me think I've listened to marinas question is like, you know, I think a lot of like, when someone says, like, you know, we have like a prized rare local food there is a stated or unstated, you know, assumption that goes along with that, and which is that, you know, you visitor are probably going to find this challenging, and maybe even like, you know, a lot of locals may find this challenging. And that is, that is certainly true of some foods in Japan. So, I am trying to, like have more of an open mind to those sorts of things like Not, not that I've closed minded about them, but just like going in with the assumption like, you know, this is a rare price thing, because some people really enjoy eating it. And maybe I could be one of those people too. And so like a couple of examples that come to mind. So one one is a thing that I didn't eat and wish I had, which is, many years ago, we took a trip to Thailand, we ate a couple times at this restaurant called wall on Pong food station, which is one of the best restaurants I've ever been to in my life. And they had on the specials board and Aunt egg omelet that I kept looking up at it and being and being like, I wonder what that's like, and I didn't try it. And I wish I had more recently in Japan. They already mentioned the buttered potato dish that we got,
Molly 31:49
oh, that sounds familiar to me. But I It could just be because butter and potatoes. So there's
Matthew Amster-Burton 31:54
actually like a phrase in in Japanese that means like rare tastes or special tastes that refers to this kind of food that is you know, not to everyone's taste, but it's probably expensive and interesting and some and some people really go for and one of those things is she Okada, which is salted fermented seafood or shellfish innards. Hmm. So we have this this this dish that I did not realize was going to contain this what I ordered it but was like foil roasted potatoes with butter and squid she'll caught up so like some some part of the squid that has been salted and fermented for quite a while, I think, maybe like for a year. And so it's like very salty, very intense and funky and has like a chewy texture that is no longer really like what you expect of like, either raw or cooked squid. And did I like actively like it? Not really, but like I was, you know, excited that we had gotten something rare and unexpected. And I really liked the kind of like, you know, intense savory undertone that it gave to the whole dish even though I didn't eat many of the actual like squid bits. And we also like I probably talked about this also, but we we had we had some mountain vegetables and another meal and mountain vegetables is like, you know, it's like wild gathered forage stuff that is generally like not cultivatable then we're talking different from like a mountain yam differ from a mountain yam so that's not technically considered a mountain vegetable even though it has mountain in the name I think because it's because it can be cultivated these are these are more like you know, seasonal things like you know, like the North American equivalent I think it'd be like ramps like you really only get them in season and they're and they're only like wild gathered and so we had one one of those that we had on this trip was called Deaf hooky which is which translates as butterbur in English okay and we had a two different two different parts of the plant that I don't think I even realized when I was ordering were two different parts of the same plant until I like looked it up on my little dictionary app. But it's sort of like a you know like a celery like watery stock with like a flowering head and both parts are eaten. So we had we had like a you know kind of lightly dressed salad of the of the stocks which I found more challenging they have like you know, they they look and chew like celery but have a very different flavor with kind of like a sweetness to them. Then the flower buds like the flowering the the inflorescences were served in like Goma I like a like sesame dressing and that I love just like I intensely like chewy texture and like very like green vegetable flavor. I was like all over that dish.
Molly 34:37
Oh man, I love hearing about this. Oh, I'm so glad
Matthew Amster-Burton 34:41
I want to encounter more like rare foods while traveling in the future and like try and be like more open to enjoying them than maybe I have been in the past.
Molly 34:51
Good job, Matthew and thank you listener Marina for asking us such a great question. And
Matthew Amster-Burton 34:55
of course we'll link to listener flurries article in the show notes
Molly 35:00
Great. Well, Matthew, anything else that we want to add?
Matthew Amster-Burton 35:03
No, I'm just I'm just so excited. We got to talk to two of the walks of life. I know
Molly 35:07
it's like a true brush with celebrity. You're amazing. Okay. Well our producer is Abby circuit tele.
Matthew Amster-Burton 35:13
Also like it's great that we get to work with producer Abby celebrity producer.
Molly 35:17
Yes, it's true. It's true.
Matthew Amster-Burton 35:18
She She produced you know when? When Paula Abdul and MC Skat Kat did that podcast where they like did like a re listen to all of Paula Jews of duels albums and talked about a different song on each episode.
Molly 35:30
Was that like Abdul Island Discs? Yeah, yeah. Okay.
Matthew Amster-Burton 35:36
And yeah, love love that show that that we just made up. i I wish we should we should like I need to relist it that song which I haven't listened to it a while so that so that next time you make an MC scat cat, like you know, feed me an MC Skat Kat line like I can follow up with with the actual line because all I will ever come up with is I like to smoke.
Molly 35:59
I hope it's okay, because I messed up my part too. I thought that I was being so smart like feeding you the first half but then when when I completed it after you messed up with the smoking part. I got it wrong.
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:11
Yeah. Okay. Well, I mean, this is really for the jury to decide at this point. Like, you know, we've done the crime. We're gonna do the time okay. Please rate and review us wherever you get your podcasts like you can say say like, it's it's better than that MC scat cat podcast that doesn't exist.
Molly 36:28
You can chat with other spilled milk listeners on Reddit at everything spilled milk.reddit.com
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:33
Thanks to the listener who I think the last episode I asked if there was like a Tinder for friends and we call it friend grinder and someone somebody posted and said, yeah, there is something like that. So thank you to that person.
Molly 36:44
Thank you. Well, thank you for listening to spilled milk. The show that
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:49
we've been we've been like, like crisping together so long. You'll never pull us apart.
Molly 36:54
That's so good. Matthew Foley Weisenberg. And I'm
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:58
Matthew Amster-Burton.
Molly 37:08
Let so
Matthew Amster-Burton 37:09
two segments Okay.