Today we're just a couple of harmless eccentrics in our dotage as we provide listeners with another classic chewing episode with strong dirt components. Its true that Molly has come a long way, but she still gets weepy as she tries to shirk her professional duty while Matthew decides to get rich or die trying. Toxic and poisonous flavors open up to us before we share some accidental origin stories and our failed attempts at palette expansion.
Calling all LILYs ! Send us your Memory Lane for our upcoming 15 year anniversary!
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:00
Hi I'm Matt
Molly 0:05
and I'm Molly and this
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:06
is Spilled Milk The show where we cook something delicious. Eat it all and you can't have
Molly 0:10
any today we are talking about black liquor. Yes,
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:13
no Red Vines here I'll know. Red Vines brand black licorice. With such it's, it's an oxymoronic product. And this was suggested by listener Jenna Thank you listener Jenna.
Molly 0:28
Wow. Okay,
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:29
so shall we go down memory lane? It's
Molly 0:31
do I mean Okay, so I used to really hate anything that had a licorice anise fennel type flavor. I
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:39
think a lot of people do. It's certainly a polarizing flavor. Yeah.
Molly 0:43
And I mean, I think I've come a long way in the areas that I have recently. You've come a long way in many areas tested myself in like so. I honestly I don't even remember the last time I ate licorice candy because I have always disliked it so much.
Matthew Amster-Burton 0:59
Is it? Is it more of the flavor or more of the texture? The flavor? Okay,
Molly 1:02
I love the texture.
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:04
It does stick to your teeth, which I know is not your favorite thing. Okay. Yeah.
Molly 1:07
But I do love like licorice tea. Throat coat has sure
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:11
ish thing going always have licorice spice tea.
Molly 1:15
Yeah, it's so good. It's so good. But yeah, I It's been a long time since I've eaten this stuff. I've always avoided it and I'm straight up terrified of like, salted licorice, like the stuff that's so popular in Scandinavia
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:29
and we tasted that on the show at least once like in a like an international snack box episode. I didn't get any of that today. Okay, so while
Molly 1:39
you're on memory lane, I think we should open this box of good and plenty. Okay,
Matthew Amster-Burton 1:43
let's do it. So I have always liked licorice and my dad also is a licorice man, but like I've never like gone out of my way for it like really the only the only candy that I that I deliberately buy his chocolate pretty much but I do like when I was a kid good and plenty was absolutely one of my favorite candies and seemed like a huge treat every time and we've got some right now we're gonna crunch it. These are smaller than I remember them. I guess I was smaller when I was a kid. Okay, well
Molly 2:11
I don't hate that.
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:12
Were you smaller when you were a kid? Are you about the
Molly 2:14
same size? Do the pink and the white taste any different? They
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:18
don't. These are supposed to be crunchy or I feel like these have like either they changed the formula or they've like taken on water.
Molly 2:28
Like a boat. Gonna say like a boat with a leak.
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:33
But I still like you know, I
Molly 2:34
don't dislike it. But I'm not sure what I'm supposed to like.
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:38
That'd be a crunchy candy shell.
Molly 2:40
Really more crunchy than this? Yeah, this shells kind of like a jelly bean shell.
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:45
You don't know it's supposed to be a lot crunch here. Oh, really? It's not supposed to be like Mike and Ike texture.
Molly 2:51
I don't know what this is supposed to do for me.
Matthew Amster-Burton 2:56
But for it's supposed to crunch for oil. It's supposed to be something you look forward to in your stocking.
Molly 3:07
Do you? Oh, hold on. Are we going to also talk about like licorice flavored things. I mean, I know we mentioned jerky. But what about like, do you ever eat like licorice ice cream or
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:17
like so? I don't think I've had licorice ice cream quite a while I understand it's popular in Canada as well.
Molly 3:21
Oh, smell these.
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:25
Oh, wow. Now we've got like, like evil mustaches.
Molly 3:28
So we're we've got the Red Vines black licorice rolling here. Okay, just kind of like how it tastes like dirt. Yeah, there's
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:35
one doesn't have much flavor. Yeah, so yeah, so So in Canada, they have tiger tail ice cream, which I think is like licorice and orange striped. But when I was a kid, there was
Molly 3:49
licorice and orange striped. Yes. Is licorice and color now?
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:54
Yeah, but the orange is a flavor. Oh,
Molly 3:58
I thought you meant visually.
Matthew Amster-Burton 3:59
I think okay, someone Canadian listeners. Can you please get in touch contact? It's filled milk podcast.com and let me know if my understanding of tigertail ice cream is correct. That is like licorice flavor was striped with orange flavored ice cream, or is it just licorice flavored ice cream that has orange colored stripes? I genuinely don't know the answer. When I was a kid, we used to go to this ice cream place called wrestlers. 33 flavors, which I know sounds like something from The Simpsons, but was a real chain that predated Baskin Robbins and apparently didn't go out of business till 2007 But they had a problematically named flavor called licorice voodoo, which was one of my favorite flavors, which was a striped licorice flavor. And I found online an old wrestlers menu like a really old one for like the 50s that had licorice voodoo on there, along with a flood unexplained flavor called Mr. K ice cream. I spent like 20 minutes, dredging the seafloor of Google try to figure out what the hell is Miss stir K ice cream and came up with nothing. Okay,
Molly 5:02
hold on. It's licorice ice cream. How does the flavor of licorice work with the flavor of cream?
Matthew Amster-Burton 5:08
I mean, I think it's good. Like I haven't had it in a long time but I kind of remember what it tasted like okay. You know it's a strong it's a strong flavor so so it's gonna come through and then I got I got like this assorted so we've tried the Red Vines. We tried the good and plenty and then I got from from my local like, like fancy little store. Just some like assorted licorice shapes.
Molly 5:33
Feeling a little weepy looking at that. It looks really intense. It's not good. Pretty good. Which one is that the log? This is like the log. This looks like it has a nice texture or
Matthew Amster-Burton 5:45
does is pretty strong. Actually. There's a classic chewing episode.
Molly 5:50
Ooh, something about the taste of licorice. And as a strong dirt component to it. Like dirt. The color brown. I mean, it just opened up its flavors.
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:06
But you're also describing like beets? No,
Molly 6:09
I'm aware. Wow. Okay, I got to a certain point like 30 seconds into chewing this candy. When suddenly it bloomed. And I hate it. This one.
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:20
This one is a 50 euro coin.
Molly 6:22
I hate this.
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:24
Oh, wow. Oh no.
Molly 6:30
Oh, God. This one. This one has a hint of smoke.
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:35
But it's it's so hard.
Molly 6:39
Don't give up man. Do I'll just keep talking.
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:43
No, I can't. I'm not going to spit it out. Hold
Molly 6:45
on. The thing that this stuff is the fragrance is really interesting. Like I might enjoy a candle scented like this. Okay, wait,
Matthew Amster-Burton 6:52
there's also a white thing in here. Really wild smell that I think might just be a piece of plastic.
Unknown Speaker 7:00
You gotta eat it
Matthew Amster-Burton 7:01
just seems like I can't even dent it with my fingers.
Molly 7:04
Maybe that's what maybe that's like a artisanal good and plenty. Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 7:08
maybe it's artisanal. Good and flat. telling
Molly 7:11
you that's what it is. How are you?
Matthew Amster-Burton 7:14
How are you doing? To finish the round the round boy first.
Molly 7:17
How are you doing with 50 cent? Oh 20 euro cent?
Matthew Amster-Burton 7:22
Was it 2950 cent? I'm chewing 50 cent? I'm gonna I'm gonna get rich or die trying. Salty. A little bit salty. Yeah. Not like not like you are imagining stuff
Molly 7:35
is so difficult for me. I feel a little bit like I might cry. I
Matthew Amster-Burton 7:42
feel like in my dotage. I want to be like a guy who's like sitting on just got a street corner in somewhere in Europe, like just eating this stuff. Like that seems it seems like that's a character that's like an eccentric the kind of extension of harmless eccentric that I would like to be. Yeah, yeah, I think that's great. Which which could could actually turn out to be problematic as we'll get to. A little bit.
Molly 8:05
I think that Okay, so if I'm going to be in my dotage, and I can be somewhere in your you are let's, I'm going you're lucky. I mean, I'd love to get into my dosage. May I live that long? I think I'd like to also maybe be in Europe. And I think I would like to, you know, like sit around on you know, like a bench in a cafe in a in a plaza with with my lady friends and watch the world go by and I think I'll take up smoking cigarettes. Yeah. I took a workshop over the weekend with John Dowd is like better older with an older woman, American poet, and she smoked off and on through the whole workshop. It was amazing. That's what poets do. It was a she was perfect. Okay.
Matthew Amster-Burton 8:50
I have a lot to report about licorice. Like what it is why, but I really want to try this.
Molly 8:56
You got to try that white thing. Oh, what's it doing?
Unknown Speaker 9:01
No. Oh,
Molly 9:02
you look you look like you've just received some very confusing news.
Matthew Amster-Burton 9:08
This is a this is not a texture I've ever had in my mouth before you need to try this. Absolutely not. No, you have to try this is what is your professional duty. It's not bad. It you're not gonna like it but it's not going to ruin probably. And we have to we have to talk about this texture. First First off, see like, like, trying to like poke it with your with your fingernails. See how hard it is? Oh, I can barely get a fingernail in there. Right so I expect it to be like a hard candy like like that. I got my hair cut this morning and I got a free Dum Dum lollipop. And I expect it to be that texture but it's not okay.
Molly 9:53
It crackles it's a little stringy. It's stringing apart in my job.
Matthew Amster-Burton 9:58
It's like it's like a dehydrated stringy cheese, but like, it's
Molly 10:02
like flaking now. flaking. Oh, it's really dissolving.
Matthew Amster-Burton 10:08
I don't even know if I would identify that as licorice. If it didn't come in a licorice pack the flavors kind of different. I don't know what we just ate or if we'll survive, but it's
Molly 10:18
sort of just like
Matthew Amster-Burton 10:26
oh, oh, can I tell you another thing?
Molly 10:28
You could just like disintegrate? It? Kinda reminds me a mountain yam like yeah, the way
Matthew Amster-Burton 10:33
you think could be it could be dehydrated Yama, Yama. Yeah. You put
Molly 10:38
mountain yam in your mouth and it just turns into like an explosion. Explosion of liquid slime. This turned into weird stringy followed by flaky followed by powdery and then it was gone. I kind
Matthew Amster-Burton 10:51
of like there's another we didn't try near. I mean, there's probably like seven different shapes in here. But there's there's like
Molly 10:58
a spider some really big one. I can't go anywhere near that. Okay, I
Matthew Amster-Burton 11:01
gotta I gotta try this part. Okay, so So asked me what's licorice is teaming up for the next. What's licorice? I can't tell you I'm sure in this spiral. First off, I did not know and I feel like how could I not have known this but in in British English and also on Wikipedia. It's spelled li qu o r ice like liquor. Right? So like, if you're from the UK, I assume you're now saying like, how else would you possibly spell it in America? It's LIC Oh, our ice? Yeah. So licorice is a plant. glycyrrhiza. glabra but the relationship of this plant to licorice candy is kind of complicated. Okay, we'll get there. Okay,
Molly 11:42
so wait when we talk about licorice or we, we talk about it as a plant that we consume. are we consuming only it's the route right?
Matthew Amster-Burton 11:51
Well, that kind of oh, okay, sorry. Go ahead. So, licorice root as in like the peeled root of the of the Glycyrrhiza glabra plant has long been used as a traditional medicinal as flavoring it like yeah, like made into a tea or like you know powder. I
Molly 12:08
mean, I mean the tea brand.
Matthew Amster-Burton 12:11
strikeout Yeah, yeah, throw cow goes back 1000s of years. And as he flavoring and a snack like people have been like just kind of chewing on twigs of licorice because they taste good and are sweet. Okay, for a long time. Okay. Licorice is native to the greater Mediterranean region. So like Southern Europe, Western Asia, North Africa, and the largest producers today are Turkey, Greece, Iran and Iraq. According to Wikipedia quote, dried sticks of the licorice root are a traditional confectionery in the Netherlands as they were once in Britain. They were sold simply a sticks of zoo tout Sweetwood to chew on as a candy. Okay, and at this point, we're going to need to get Mr. Botany in
Molly 12:49
here. You know, hold up I feel like I might like just the straight up licorice.
Matthew Amster-Burton 12:53
I yeah, I wouldn't want to try chewing on this but I did not find any at Safeway.
Molly 13:02
Is Mr. Bought me available? Mr. Barney
Matthew Amster-Burton 13:04
is available and I am going to
Speaker 1 13:08
come in Lulu Lulu Lulu. Toodle doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo Oh,
Matthew Amster-Burton 13:19
botany plant man. Okay, so Mr. Botany would like you to know that there are four very common herbs and spices and possibly more than four but for that, like I was easily able to find or just think of the taste licorice G All right. So there's licorice root there, Star Anna's there's aniseed and there's Tara god. Okay, would you agree that all of these smell and or tastes licorice?
Molly 13:44
I would agree. Hold up. Where's phenol in here? Oh, shit.
Matthew Amster-Burton 13:48
I didn't even put phenol in here. You're right, five. Okay, there's five. Okay, so so I don't even know where fennel gets, like phenols like in the carrot family. I don't remember if any of these other ones are in the carrot family. Okay, okay. The thing is, none of these four plants not even counting fennel are closely related to any of the others. Really? They're in four different families. Okay, so not just different species but distantly related. Okay. Okay, Anna's and star anise both produce Anna Thol, a flavor compound and the other to produce different licorice melon compounds.
Molly 14:26
Okay. Wow. Okay. So even though they're distantly related, anise seed and star and the
Matthew Amster-Burton 14:36
same compound.
Molly 14:37
Okay, that's so yeah. Like, why
Matthew Amster-Burton 14:39
are we talking about things other than licorice? We'll get there very soon. Okay, go ahead. Okay, so it is worth noting that the Latin name of aniseed is pimpinella anisum.
Molly 14:48
Wow, that's awesome. That's Pippin. Yeah.
Matthew Amster-Burton 14:52
So So I was like, I went down a rabbit hole like even deeper than the rabbit hole where I was trying to figure out what is Mr. K ice cream? Like how do plants in different families and are producing like stuff that smells the same and in some cases, even the same compound. So the plants don't use these compounds to attract like Dutch people they produce, they use them as pesticides. Oh, right. So I think plants have a toolkit of biosynthesis pathways that they use to adapt their pesticide production to whatever the local threats are over, like evolutionary time. And so that is so and this, this toolkit means like, they're starting with some like basic molecules that can only be put together in certain ways. So it's not like every plant starts from scratch, wedded over a period of millions of years figures out like here's, here's the kinds of fungi and bacteria and insects that I want to ward off. So it's not out of the question for plants to converge on producing the same smelly tasty compounds. And that's what happened here. Interesting, isn't it? That's so interesting. Yeah. And then the other thing I realized was like there's you know, there are a lot of different smells in the world but not an infinite number. So you know, to the plants these might not seem as similar as they do to us. I
Molly 16:09
wonder what insects Uh, well I guess maybe it doesn't have to be insects probate as though like Does anybody use like Anna's as like, as
Matthew Amster-Burton 16:20
like a like a organic insecticide? Yeah, I don't know.
Molly 16:24
Or as like, hit us up DT supplement supplement is
Matthew Amster-Burton 16:28
it yeah, do just like rub it all over your that was rubbing all over yourself. You would smell like like, like me when I when I retired to like brought a Slava and like sit on the corner eating licorice There you go. Ya know, like the local the local Fanta isn't gonna bother me at all. That's right
so now let's fast forward from from like ancient like, like prehistoric times to 1614 in England when Sir George Savile invented the licorice format still known as Pontefract cakes when he stamped discs of licorice with the image of Pontefract Castle, so Alright, so first off, if I can explain what that is, first of all, it is exactly this thing that we just ate like the 20 euro coin, but like stamped with the seal of Pontefract Castle Okay, so, first I was reading from Wikipedia there I want to give credit. So what is this stuff that has this like chewy texture, it is a candy base made from wheat flour and molasses. Usually like these days, it could be a different starch, it could be corn syrup instead of molasses. But it's basically like a starch and like a sticky gluey sugar.
Molly 17:43
That's really interesting because the flavor of molasses, I think, is a large component of what I think of as the flavor of licorice. Yeah, I think you're right. Wow, that's so interesting. I wonder how those two became linked. I mean, maybe it was just sort of the the original easily widely available. I assume syrupy? Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 18:04
I mean, I mean, because it's because molasses we did in the last episode is a byproduct of sugar production. So it was a thing that they would have had around and looking for something to do with it. And so probably there were a lot of different flavors of candy based on like a, like a molasses and flour, bass.
Molly 18:19
Do licorice candies like this still contain wheat? I mean, someone who has a wheat sensitivity. Do you have to avoid licorice? Yes.
Matthew Amster-Burton 18:27
So ingredients. There's plenty sugar, corn syrup, enriched wheat flour.
Molly 18:33
Oh, I had no idea. Wow, that is really wild. Yes.
Matthew Amster-Burton 18:36
So there is there is certainly such a thing as gluten free licorice, but you should never assume Okay, okay. I so so. Pontefract cakes still sold under that name. Since it's 1614. I started to read about the history of Pontefract Castle, all I remember is that it was the site of a number of beheadings. Okay, cool. And pot of rock cakes are now made by Haribo, makers of many gummy things, and I didn't get any, but you can order them online. So I'm sure you well, because you're such a big fan.
Molly 19:09
We're talking here. 1614 So somebody had already figured out how to make the sort of chewy paste candy that we think of as licorice,
Matthew Amster-Burton 19:17
right? So here's where I got confused. And we might need to, to call on a friend of the show. Ken albala. So the other thing that I learned is the Dunhill company are credited with the develop of licorice as a confection by adding sugar in 1760, so 150 years after the alleged invention of Pontefract cakes, so licorice extract like it like licorice root extract is itself very sweet. It's it's much sweeter on a like weight by weight basis then sugar. It's not sweet enough to like make a licorice candy tastes like candy all by itself, but I assumed there was molasses in the original cake. or like what else? How would they like hold their shape?
Molly 20:03
I don't know I don't know I do not know and and is it always are licorice candies always chewy like this it's they're not gummy they're they're
Matthew Amster-Burton 20:12
chewy I mean more or less I think so like like these these flat ones here are extremely chewy like dental emergency level okay these Red Vines ones are like you know pretty they go down pretty easy they're I would say they're they're Red Vines text yeah so it's like how much like how much like molasses goes in?
Molly 20:32
Okay maybe like yeah okay
Matthew Amster-Burton 20:34
yeah so I see something else about yeah you know what you know what I want remember how did you ever watch like early seasons of Great British Bake Off no on early seasons they would they would cut away from the bakers and go on like a five minute backed like like mini documentary backstory about like, you know this week we're making Bakewell tarts well let's go to the to the village of Bakewell to talk about where these tarts came from. And then they talked to some food historian and there are so many food historians in England they got me felt like five of them for each of these segments. But I want one of those on Pontefract cakes, okay, which I don't think they did. But maybe so
Molly 21:13
in total this stuff. Yep. That we think of as licorice. The candy. Is this like base that's made from wheat flour most commonly Yep. And some sort of a gooey sugar like molasses. Corn syrup. Yep. Plus probably even more sugar and water I
Matthew Amster-Burton 21:33
assume so yeah. Okay. Yes, sugar corn syrup. This is good and plenty so some of the sugar is in the coding but yeah, so So these days it's probably mostly corn syrup and flour. Where
Molly 21:44
Where do they get I mean, is licorice root black? Where does this color come from? There's so distinctively black yeah
Matthew Amster-Burton 21:52
so cooked licorice root extract because you do have to cook it down he's dark brown but not black. And as far as I could tell it seems like someone just colored the candy black at some point and it's stuck probably originally with like charcoal or something nowadays is mostly artificial color. Okay, so to go back to remember I mentioned a bunch of plants that all that all tastes licorice he The reason I mentioned that is because most licorice candy today is flavored with both licorice root extract and aniseed extract usually more aniseed extract partly because aniseed extract is cheaper and partly because it's less toxic than licorice fruit extract. Oh,
Molly 22:31
so licorice root extract is toxic.
Matthew Amster-Burton 22:33
Yeah, so so we look on the on the Red Vines it's it's the ingredients are wheat flour, corn syrup, high fructose corn syrup, cane sugar, cocoa powder added for color, interesting. vinegar, salt, anise flavor and licorice extract. Okay, so yes, licorice extract is pretty toxic. Okay, it's called the extract is called glycerin Ryzen. And, you know, as with anything, it's toxic in sufficient quantities, but lower quantities than you might think. So it causes heightened blood pressure and more important suppressed potassium levels and potassium really important. Yes, low potassium can cause arrhythmia lethargy, heart failure and death. So
Molly 23:17
like how I mean, how much of this stuff do you need to eat Okay, so to be dangerous a
Matthew Amster-Burton 23:22
lot, but not so sometimes. You know, you hear you hear like, you know, like, like green potatoes or you know, they're they've got like a toxic compound in them, but like, you would have to eat like enough green potatoes that it would kill you anyway for for the like, solanine to get you. In this case, there have been like multiple cases where someone accidentally died from eating too much licorice. So most recently in 2020. From Wikipedia quote, a man from Massachusetts United States ate a bag and a half of black licorice every day for several weeks leading to death due to chronic high levels of glycerin tannic acid, a principal metabolite of glycerin organic acid, so you definitely have to go overboard with the licorice consumption. But I would not eat a bag a day.
Molly 24:08
Wow.
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:10
Wow, is that interesting? That
Molly 24:12
is very interesting. That this is very surprising.
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:16
Yeah, is there is there like, you know, I've eaten probably three times as much of it today as you. Yeah,
Molly 24:21
I mean, let me know if you're starting to notice any symptoms.
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:25
Yeah, you might like you might have to choose a new running mate. Oh, no. But yeah, I'll let you know.
Molly 24:32
I mean, I do I do. Wait a minute. Is this episode coming out before after the election? Oh, that's a good question. Dear. Before this, is
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:39
this our Halloween episode? Hey, everybody, get ready to vote. Yep. Or maybe maybe you already did. Yeah. So I mean, hopefully if I if I succumb to to licorice overdose, like hopefully they'll count my bow. Anyway. I
Molly 24:54
think it works that way. Oh, no. Okay, Matthew, just hang on a little longer. Okay.
Matthew Amster-Burton 24:59
Eggs. Have You Ever Have you ever run across licorice all sorts? No these are these are like multicolored and shaped kind of sliced licorice bits that are popular in the UK I think you would recognize I'm gonna pull up a picture like
Molly 25:11
multicolored Are they are they coated the way good and plenties are coded
Matthew Amster-Burton 25:16
all right hang on with a licorice all sorts so it's it's these guys. Oh I've seen those yeah so they're kind of squared off or triangular yeah round and like a bunch of different colors of like candy
Molly 25:30
my friend Sam really likes those Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 25:33
I mean if you like they got a nice kind of mid range licorice texture. The reason I put them in there is just because they're popular and also on Wikipedia there is my favorite thing a apocryphal accidental origin story. Great. Yeah, ready tell. Quote in 1899 Charlie Thompson, a Bassett sales representative supposedly tripped over and dropped a tray of samples he was showing to a client in Leicester mixing up the various sweets. After he scrambled to rearrange them. The client was intrigued by the new creation, the company began to mass produce the allsorts as they have done since then. Good God. So they fell on the floor. It sounds like Right. Like the client, the client was a monster. Like,
Molly 26:21
was like, who was basically my toddler. Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:25
the client who was a dog? Yes.
Molly 26:30
Literally my dog. Ah, wow. Okay, what about good and plenty? I mean, is this an old this? It's this seems like an old candy.
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:38
Yeah. So it's one of the oldest branded candies in the US first produced in Philadelphia in 1893.
Molly 26:45
Wow. Okay, that is old. Yeah. So so
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:49
like when I was getting them in my stocking as a kid like they were the new thing back then.
Molly 26:55
Nice one, uh, Matthew, I noticed that we haven't really talked about salted licorice.
Matthew Amster-Burton 26:59
Okay, so salted licorice or double salted licorice is very popular in Nordic countries and the Netherlands and it's double salted not because it has like twice as much sodium chloride, but because it has sodium chloride and ammonium chloride which gives it a very particular mouth puckering taste.
Molly 27:17
Do you think any of these were double salted? No, I
Matthew Amster-Burton 27:19
don't think so. Maybe this one? Maybe the coin one here. Like it is salty. But I don't know if it's got the ammonium. Okay. I don't think so. Okay. I kind of like it. Like I will. I will eat like a couple of pieces when I got some. But you don't right.
Molly 27:36
Oh, no, i Wow. Licorice is really a thing that I just don't care for.
Matthew Amster-Burton 27:43
Ya know, the double tall ones. They do kind of tastes like poison but but like in a
Molly 27:49
sort of a lot of cocktails is what I was gonna say like, yeah, like so does a Negroni? Yeah, no, Negroni. Straight up tastes like poor. Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 27:56
they both they both taste tastes like Wait, who's the guy from poison Vince Neil knows Motley Crue?
Unknown Speaker 28:06
Yes, yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 28:08
they taste like Bret Michaels.
Molly 28:12
Okay, Matthew. All right. Do we have to say anything else about this abomination?
Matthew Amster-Burton 28:16
I don't think so. I feel like this is fun.
Molly 28:19
I took one of these and really brave to even taste.
Matthew Amster-Burton 28:22
I really appreciate you trying one of the the bizarrely textured like white pencil eraser ones. And I had a lot of fun unrolling one of these one of these coiled ones into like a long licorice snake. It was really satisfying. It looks like I think even if you don't want to eat it, I would recommend on rolling.
Molly 28:41
Okay, Matthew, hey, we've got some spilled mail.
Matthew Amster-Burton 28:44
I'd love to hear it. Okay.
Molly 28:52
Hi, Matthew and Molly. I have been a longtime listener and always look forward to new episodes on Thursdays. Thanks for all you do. I finally have a question for you. last Halloween, my son got some Peppermint Patties which he loves. I've always thought I didn't like them, but tried them again. And oh my God, they are truly a perfectly engineered food product. And if you keep them in the fridge or freezer next level nice. I went on a binge of Peppermint Patties which has since waned a bit but they are still my go to candy. If given a choice, Junior Mints are okay, but not quite the same. A little too gooey on the inside. So my question to you both is, is there a food that you thought you didn't like but discovered you actually do like or even love? Best? Sara from Fort Collins, Colorado. Now
Matthew Amster-Burton 29:39
I kind of struggled with this because, you know, I think what Sarah is describing is a food that she thought she didn't like as an adult and then realized that actually she did because there were like a ton of thing I was a picky eater as a kid so there are kind of a ton of things I didn't like as a kid that then I was like, Oh yeah, these are good as an adult but like, like kind of everyone goes goes through do that most people go through that? So I was trying to think of things that I still didn't like as an adult and suddenly realized I did and like the two that came to mind. Okay, the public the pumpkin spice latte. Yeah. Which we tried together. And we're both both expected not to like and thought it was great. Yes. Right. Yes. And I'll usually have one every year now.
Molly 30:18
I agree. That is the first thing that came to mind for me as well. The second thing that came to mind for me is kale chips. I am like a very recent convert to kale chips.
Matthew Amster-Burton 30:30
Okay,
Molly 30:31
I thought I strongly disliked them. I had made them before and they were awful. Like they truly tasted bad. And I tried a different way of making them because I get a lot of kale from our CSA. And I really liked them. Like, I get it now. Yeah,
Matthew Amster-Burton 30:51
my other two are both Japanese foods. So like, in my 20s, I realized all my friends liked sushi. And I still like had sort of like a, like, white American kid idea of like, you know, this is this is something that that like, is challenging. And like, you know, that like I probably wouldn't like and so I was like, I am gonna go for sushi with my friends. And I'm just going to try everything. And like, immediately liked it. And then the other thing is red bean paste. Okay, so which I like challenged myself to try and get to like, and now I really do. So it's like very, very common, like dessert filling in Japanese desserts that is really just, you know, essentially made from mashed, sweetened mashed kidney beans, you know, so coming from a cultural background where like MASH beans means like refried beans, like, encountering that texture and flavor. And a dessert was really challenging at first. And I and I was kind of like, okay, this is just not for me. And then I was like, it's kind of the same thing. Like, oh, wait, like, you know, if I asked any of my friends in Japan, like, what are your favorite desserts, it's almost always going to be something involving red bean paste. Like, you know, I'm the problem here. Like, I need to, like, learn to appreciate this. So there was one trip where I'm like, I'm going to eat something with red bean paste every day on this trip. And by the end of the trip, I was like, Oh, this is great. Like, I want another like, you know, hot like burn my mouth pancake filled with tons of red bean paste.
Molly 32:19
You know what now that we're talking about it, it occurs to me that this is kind of how I feel about melons. So I grew up really disliking melon and West well into adulthood. I would say in my late 20s I was quite like melon agnostic. And I can still be there's something about the flavor sometimes of a cantaloupe. That I really don't love cantaloupe. Yeah, I'd much prefer an orange honeydew but I think that I thought if this because of your mentioning, eating red bean paste in in Japan intentionally to try to like you into some sort of melon control. No, I was just remembering being in Tokyo with you and going to talk I know and having their like sweet smell in high there was a time it well into my adulthood when I would have been like you. Like why would I? Many layers of melon parfait melon flavored stuff. Anyway, now I love melon. I love watermelon. I love honey, do I love red? Honey? Do I mean orange? Honey Do I'm okay on cantaloupe. But there was a time I mean really? Well into my 20s when I was like, with all of it interesting,
Matthew Amster-Burton 33:34
okay. Yeah, no, I try. Like I don't want to I want to like remain open minded and hope that like some of the things that I still think I don't like suddenly I'll realize that I do. You
Molly 33:46
know, I've been finding lately actually, that I'm starting to find that some things I thought I liked. I don't really like that's okay, too. And so I'm finding I, you know, I thought that adulthood would sort of work in the opposite direction in terms of flavored like pretty much exclusively like, I thought that I would continue expanding my palate. But I am finding increasingly that there are truly things that I just don't want to eat and I don't I don't think I've ever really liked them. And I've
Matthew Amster-Burton 34:17
Yeah, but but like, You're a grown up you can use things you don't like That's right.
Molly 34:21
But I think that like, I don't know, like what though? Even just the other night we so ash and I were gonna go on a date the other night and then we were both like really tired and we decided instead to stay home and to get sushi with June and kind of have it be like a special thing. Sushi is so expensive. Yeah. So anyway, we got takeout sushi. We stayed home. And admittedly I'm a very like, boring white person. Sushi eater. Yeah, I love a California roll. I love sockeye salmon. Occasionally I will get mackerel or a or eel. But in general, I'm like, pretty darn basic. And on this occasion, I got California rolls sockeye salmon, and I got some eel. And there was something about the way the sockeye was cut. It was like a little too thick and part of it. And I had a very hard time swallowing it. And the same thing goes for the eel. You know how there's sometimes like a little strip of skin or something. Like I, I swallowed it, I got it down. But I almost I was almost like, I don't know that I can do this again, like, yeah, this may be the end.
Matthew Amster-Burton 35:35
For me. For me, the thing we've talked about as far as wine that like, you know, there was a time when I was a young food person as like, like, it's important for me to learn about wine and like, learn to appreciate it. And I did learn a lot about it. I find like wine very interesting, but I don't really like to drink it. 90% of the time. That's so interesting. Like their sub dessert wines I like, but in general, like your basic like dry red or white wine. Yeah.
Molly 36:00
No. Oh, so interesting.
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:03
I do anyway, just because like, I like the experience of like drinking wine with someone and clinking glasses and stuff, but the flavor. Yeah.
Molly 36:11
That's so interesting. Yeah, I love the flavor of wine. And on the other hand, like you really enjoy a pretty wide variety of types of ciders.
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:20
I do, which I don't including, like, like the really dry ones. Yeah, I don't
Molly 36:25
enjoy those. Anyway. Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, it's hard to say like, I think that my thing that I experienced with sushi the other day, it was almost exclusively a textural thing. I
Matthew Amster-Burton 36:36
don't I don't think that's like, really fits the discretion of like, like deciding you didn't like something
Molly 36:42
I think. But I've been noticing this for a while. I feel like if anything, I'm getting less adventurous when it comes to I'm thinking just specifically of sushi. Like I used to really branch out much more. Yeah. And I find that I'm getting less, that my range of tolerances is narrower.
Matthew Amster-Burton 37:01
So when you're when you're in your dosage, like sitting on sitting on the street corner in Prague, like you're not going to be like, eating handfuls of Guney?
Molly 37:11
Probably not. Probably not. But
Matthew Amster-Burton 37:14
I mean that that would really make you a local character. Oh,
Molly 37:18
man, especially if it were like, not even yet, loony. If it were like the living the living
Matthew Amster-Burton 37:23
like yeah, just cracking open sea urchin like spiny. Yeah.
Molly 37:28
Okay, here we go. Matthew, I think we're done.
Matthew Amster-Burton 37:31
I think we're done. Here we go. That's that's how we add every episode. And here we go. Our producers obviously Fidella Molly has a wonderful newsletter that I will interrupt her to tell you. Although I've got a feeling that is available at Molly weisenberg.substack.com. I subscribe and I recommend you do the same.
Molly 37:51
Oh, thanks, Matthew. Matthew makes music mostly with a band called early to the airport by now. I think they've got a new LP EP. Ep.
Matthew Amster-Burton 38:00
Yeah out. I sure hope so. Things are moving a little slowly. But we are we are creeping our way to the finish line. And I've been I've been like listening to tracks like like, as we get them ready to send over to the to the engineer and like, I did some pretty good singing on this album. It's
Molly 38:17
so cool. So cool. So yeah, look for early to the airport anywhere you find music,
Matthew Amster-Burton 38:22
and rate and review us wherever you get your podcasts
Molly 38:25
and you can chat with other spilled milk listeners at everything spilled. milk.reddit.com Yes.
Matthew Amster-Burton 38:30
And yeah, we always do like a call to action like you're supposed to do to like get more engagement. And this time I really want people to discuss like if you're if you're, like retired and sitting on a street corner, where are you going to be like, What city is the street corner gonna be in and what are you going to be eating? Or whittling or smoking or smoking? Yes, yeah.
Molly 38:51
Yeah. Okay, great.
Matthew Amster-Burton 38:53
This basically listeners, what are you smoking?
Molly 38:55
That's right. That was what we always want to know. Yeah. All right. Well, thank you for listening to you
Matthew Amster-Burton 39:01
watch smoking. Release the token. fare box. I'm Matthew Amster-Burton. I'm
Molly 39:13
Molly Weissenberg.
I don't know if I've ever had good and plenty. Oh,
Matthew Amster-Burton 39:25
I'm excited for you to try it.
Molly 39:26
I'm excited to like the sound. Yeah, it's
Matthew Amster-Burton 39:31
got a good shake. The show that's got a good shake. That was the episode.
Molly 39:38
Okay, I'll go home now.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai